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Lee
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Judged:
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Read the News Comment where the Vet said 'in a civilised country notices would be put up' re dogs on beach. I get this and do not mean to be disrespectful to all Cyps, as I do not tar all with the same brush, good and bad in every country, etc, however the words 'civilised' and 'Cyprus' don't go together when referring to animals. Some Cypriots cruelty to defenceless animals knows no bounds - maddening to know that in the 21st century savagery like this still exists. I can tolerate 'some not all Cyps' dumping their litter all over the island, washing their cars, pavements, patios, gardens and anything else that's static, or moving even, during a water shortage, hard to accept the selfishness of it all, but cowardly cruelty is totally unacceptable.
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Joined: Jun 2, 2008
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Lee wrote: Read the News Comment where the Vet said 'in a civilised country notices would be put up' re dogs on beach.
I get this and do not mean to be disrespectful to all Cyps, as I do not tar all with the same brush, good and bad in every country, etc, however
the words 'civilised' and 'Cyprus' don't go together when referring to animals. Some Cypriots cruelty to defenceless animals knows no bounds - maddening to know that in the 21st century savagery like this still exists. I can tolerate 'some not all Cyps' dumping their litter all over the island, washing their cars, pavements, patios, gardens and anything else that's static, or moving even, during a water shortage, hard to accept the selfishness of it all, but cowardly cruelty is totally unacceptable. I have been to many beaches in the UK which have no notices regarding keeping dogs away. So the UK is not civilised? Have a look at some of the RSPCA reports to see the hidden side of animal cruelty in the UK ... where no one talks to each other and much more happens out of view!. Leaving dogs tethered because otherwise they would run astray in fields without boundaries,is a little more civilised than my near neighbour in the UK, who intentionally boiled her kitten alive in the washing machine!
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Lee
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Chimera wrote: <quoted text>
I have been to many beaches in the UK which have no notices regarding keeping dogs away.
So the UK is not civilised?
Have a look at some of the RSPCA reports to see the hidden side of animal cruelty in the UK ... where no one talks to each other and much more happens out of view!.
Leaving dogs tethered because otherwise they would run astray in fields without boundaries,is a little more civilised than my near neighbour in the UK, who intentionally boiled her kitten alive in the washing machine! I see your point and agree to an extent. However, tethered in my book is not the same as caged 24/7 and released for a short break at the weekend. I have lived in Cyprus and seen this happen. My Cyp neighbours have 2 large dogs who are kept in a cage day and night. I never saw them come out once. I don't deny cruelty to animals is world-wide, but I know what I've seen in Cyprus and hate it. If I lived in Turkey, and they were cruel - I know they are, I would comment likewise. This is not a UK v Cyprus thing - I hate England, this is a Lee v Animal Cruelty - fresh in my mind as just returned from Larnaca.
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Joined: Jun 2, 2008
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Lee wrote: <quoted text>
I see your point and agree to an extent. However, tethered in my book is not the same as caged 24/7 and released for a short break at the weekend. I have lived in Cyprus and seen this happen. My Cyp neighbours have 2 large dogs who are kept in a cage day and night. I never saw them come out once. I don't deny cruelty to animals is world-wide, but I know what I've seen in Cyprus and hate it. If I lived in Turkey, and they were cruel - I know they are, I would comment likewise. This is not a UK v Cyprus thing - I hate England, this is a Lee v Animal Cruelty - fresh in my mind as just returned from Larnaca. Agree also I do not want to get into a Cyprus vs UK thing as I believe people are the same wherever you go, but cultural perspectives vary. Whilst animals kept as pets / hunting dogs may appear to be more neglected in Cyprus, I would not class this as deliberate cruelty, just a matter of prioritisation. In the UK whilst you witness extremes of pampering of pets, you likewise witness extremes of cruelty. I don't think such cases of extreme cruelty are any more prevalent in Cyprus. But human nature being what it is, we can only hope we all improve with time.
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anti-cruelty
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Chimera wrote: <quoted text>
Agree also I do not want to get into a Cyprus vs UK thing as I believe people are the same wherever you go, but cultural perspectives vary.
Whilst animals kept as pets / hunting dogs may appear to be more neglected in Cyprus, I would not class this as deliberate cruelty, just a matter of prioritisation.
In the UK whilst you witness extremes of pampering of pets, you likewise witness extremes of cruelty. I don't think such cases of extreme cruelty are any more prevalent in Cyprus.
But human nature being what it is, we can only hope we all improve with time. nothing will improve unless people admit there is a problem. when people accept it or ignore as something that exists elsewhere the problem will continue. It is cruel to the animals but also a sign of insensitive and cruel hearts of the humans who kick, hurt and abandone these animals. These people are not kind sensitive people who just hate animals, they are barbaric insensitive cruel inhumain people who can exploit and abuse people as well. animal cruelty is the sign of sick minds. Don't you people worry about teaching your children to love animals and how can you do it by kicking and hurting them? There will always be sick people everywhere in the world who do that but when animal cruelty is so common, as in Cyprus, somebody should look closer to the seriousness of the problem. Most of the sick murderers in the world, they were animal abusers and got pleasure watching animals and people suffer. You can't claim to love humans and be a kind a good person and hurt animals. You can't use these hunting dogs and when you decide they are not serving you well, abandone them in the mountains. Grow a heart people.
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Joined: Jun 2, 2008
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anti-cruelty wrote: <quoted text>
nothing will improve unless people admit there is a problem. when people accept it or ignore as something that exists elsewhere the problem will continue. It is cruel to the animals but also a sign of insensitive and cruel hearts of the humans who kick, hurt and abandone these animals. These people are not kind sensitive people who just hate animals, they are barbaric insensitive cruel inhumain people who can exploit and abuse people as well. animal cruelty is the sign of sick minds. Don't you people worry about teaching your children to love animals and how can you do it by kicking and hurting them? There will always be sick people everywhere in the world who do that but when animal cruelty is so common, as in Cyprus, somebody should look closer to the seriousness of the problem. Most of the sick murderers in the world, they were animal abusers and got pleasure watching animals and people suffer. You can't claim to love humans and be a kind a good person and hurt animals. You can't use these hunting dogs and when you decide they are not serving you well, abandone them in the mountains. Grow a heart people. There are people that refuse to look at problems nearby, because it's easier to blame others and demand they change first. Attempting to pretend cruelty only exists somewhere else is feeding to xenophobia. I have lived in both UK and Cyprus and I can honestly say, there is no more animal cruelty in Cyprus than there is in the UK. But Cyprus is a more open society though, and they do not hide neglect as much, because it does not yet have the same stigma. In the UK it is merely hidden better ... have a look at some of the RSPCA cases. There is enough to tackle at home. Open your eyes to what happens in your own neighbourhood. We ALL have a long way to go to respect Animal Rights ....
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Lee
Leatherhead, UK
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Valid points from you both. I just wish it would all STOP
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Turko
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Judged:
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Lee wrote: Valid points from you both. I just wish it would all STOP Same goes to the North Cyprus, my side of the island, Educating people to love animals is a long term proses, What we need to take immediate effect now is very strict laws now. protecting animals from any kind of cruelty, even the hunt dog should be able to come out of the cage, no excuse what so ever to keep a dog locked up 11 month of the year, or even a day,
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Joined: Jun 2, 2008
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Agree .... everyone needs to be made more aware of the plight of animals at the hands of Humans. Let us not forget the millions of animals in research labs across the world, as well as in Agriculture. BTW Turko ..... there is no "your side" of the island, nor "North Cyprus". There is just Cyprus!.... If you don't like a whole Cyprus, go back to Turkey!
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Turko
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Chimera wrote: Agree .... everyone needs to be made more aware of the plight of animals at the hands of Humans.
Let us not forget the millions of animals in research labs across the world, as well as in Agriculture.
BTW Turko ..... there is no "your side" of the island, nor "North Cyprus".
There is just Cyprus!.... If you don't like a whole Cyprus, go back to Turkey! Of course there is north Cyprus, that is where i live , that is the part where G/Cs forced me to withdraw and asked for 40.000 troop to protect me and my family, from being massacred, And of course there is the south where my village is, where my House is or was, where my family's lands are, and of course i have family members, ihave friends, i have country fellow man woman and children, who shed blood on that soil, so Mr chimera that makes me part of that soil, therefore Mr chimera i have rights on north or south of that island , more then you can imagine
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Joined: Jun 2, 2008
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Turko wrote: <quoted text>
Of course there is north Cyprus,
that is where i live , that is the part where
G/Cs forced me to withdraw and asked for 40.000
troop to protect me and my family, from being
massacred,
And of course there is the south where my village is, where my House is or was, where my family's lands are,
and of course i have family members, ihave friends, i have country fellow man woman and children, who shed blood on that soil,
so Mr chimera that makes me part of that soil,
therefore Mr chimera i have rights on north or south of that island , more then you can imagine Glad to see you exercising your rights in not being able to live with those 40,000 Turkish troops and countless Turkish settlers, and settling for the UK instead .... So "no-thanks!" for bringing them onto my territory and then scarpering off yourself!
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Turko
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Chimera wrote: <quoted text>
Glad to see you exercising your rights in not being able to live with those 40,000 Turkish troops and countless Turkish settlers, and settling for the UK instead ....
So "no-thanks!" for bringing them onto my territory and then scarpering off yourself! Ok i see your point, and i am sorry if it causes you discomfort , i know Cyprus is your country also, But don't you think it is better to stay safe, and i mean both sides, until we find a resolution that is acceptable by both sides, The Troops are not hurting you or anyone, and they are there only up until we all Cypriots say Thank you, You can go now we will be okay now, Please tell me if the Troops wasn't deployed to Cyprus, and no one intervened, what would have been the last result the faith of the T/Cs and many G/Cs, how many would have survived, bearing in mind we would have gave you a run for your money, we wasn't about to Keel-over and die,
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ozz-
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Turko wrote: <quoted text>
Ok i see your point,
and i am sorry if it causes you discomfort , i know Cyprus is your country also,
But don't you think it is better to stay safe, and i mean both sides, until we find a resolution
that is acceptable by both sides, The Troops are not hurting you or anyone, and they are there only up until we all Cypriots say Thank you,
You can go now we will be okay now,
Please tell me if the Troops wasn't deployed to Cyprus, and no one intervened, what would have been the last result the faith of the T/Cs and many G/Cs, how many would have survived,
bearing in mind we would have gave you a run for your money, we wasn't about to Keel-over and die, Good point you raise Turko...and as a Cypriot that lived there until just after the invasion , i understand and agree with you in terms of fleeing for safety. And in reality, no one knows wat would have eventuated after the coup...but i think EOKA B was more concerned abt capturing the Makarios boys rather than being concerned about the TCs. But i do disagree with you in terms of the turkish troops leaving...and that is the opinion of probably 99.99% of GC. And what about the approx 100,00 mainland turks? What are they going to do? Bottom line is that the turkish army is seen as an invasion army....a foreign country in Cyprus..illegally. I think the GCs always insisted that in order to negotiate, foreign invasion forces and people must leave the island... I know that many TCs see this as a threat ( without the turkish army to protect them)...but lets face it..unless both sides learn to live peacefully with each they will be no solution....no peace...
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Turko
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ozz- wrote: <quoted text>
Good point you raise Turko...and as a Cypriot that lived there until just after the invasion , i understand and agree with you in terms of fleeing for safety. And in reality, no one knows wat would have eventuated after the coup...but i think EOKA B was more concerned abt capturing the Makarios boys rather than being concerned about the TCs.
But i do disagree with you in terms of the turkish troops leaving...and that is the opinion of probably 99.99% of GC. And what about the approx 100,00 mainland turks? What are they going to do? Bottom line is that the turkish army is seen as an invasion army....a foreign country in Cyprus..illegally. I think the GCs always insisted that in order to negotiate, foreign invasion forces and people must leave the island... I know that many TCs see this as a threat ( without the turkish army to protect them)...but lets face it..unless both sides learn to live peacefully with each they will be no solution....no peace... From what Nikos Samson said in France when he was asked , if he remained in power what would have been the faith of Cyprus and the T/Cs, he's reply He would have handed Cyprus over to Greece on a platter with not a single T/C on the island, Eoka Terrorists vowed, made a solemn promise to cleanse Cyprus from T/Cs, Looking back at Nikos Samson, and Eoka's past shows many T/Cs lost their lives in the hands of these terrorists, Having the army on the island and chasing these Terrorists away is a good thing for the T/Cs i don't expect you to feel the relief like we T/Cs do, You understand why we the T/Cs feel safe and we want to continue feeling like this until a solution for the island is found, why cant we continue on these bases and look for a peace plan, it is not inconveniencing any one or thing, But if we are looking to have the Troops leave the island along with the settlers, then we Turkish Cypriots are left vulnerable, i am not saying G/Cs will attack us but we wont feel safe, Many settlers family's are born in Cyprus they are Cypriot just like the immigrants on the south, as for the Troops, remaining on the island, is a matter of security for the island , reduction is possible, if an agreement is feasible, I do fully agree with you on your ideology Quote : )...but lets face it..unless both sides learn to live peacefully with each they will be no solution. no peace. UNQUOT
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ozz-
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Turko wrote: <quoted text>
From what Nikos Samson said in France when he was asked , if he remained in power what would have been the faith of Cyprus and the T/Cs, he's reply
He would have handed Cyprus over to Greece on a platter with not a single T/C on the island,
Eoka Terrorists vowed, made a solemn promise to cleanse Cyprus from T/Cs,
Looking back at Nikos Samson, and Eoka's past
shows many T/Cs lost their lives in the hands of these terrorists,
Having the army on the island and chasing these Terrorists away is a good thing for the T/Cs i don't expect you to feel the relief like we T/Cs do,
You understand why we the T/Cs feel safe
and we want to continue feeling like this until a solution for the island is found, why cant we continue on these bases and look for a peace plan, it is not inconveniencing any one or thing,
But if we are looking to have the Troops leave the island along with the settlers, then we Turkish Cypriots are left vulnerable, i am not saying G/Cs will attack us but we wont feel safe,
Many settlers family's are born in Cyprus they are Cypriot just like the immigrants on the south, as for the Troops, remaining on the island, is a matter of security for the island , reduction is possible, if an agreement is feasible,
I do fully agree with you on your ideology Quote :
)...but lets face it..unless both sides learn to live peacefully with each they will be no solution. no peace. UNQUOT I think Mr Sampson, although a seen as a hero during the 1967 uprising, and then during the fight for independence against the British, was nothing but a puppet for the Greek Junta who orchestrated the coup in Cyprus. He acted like an idiot, amongst the euphoria of the coup. I think his comments about the TCs is nothing but rhetoric. Do you think he would have been allowed to eben touch the TCs??? I am sure he knew that if he did, Turkey would have intervened...as I am sure a lot of GCs and the international community would allow such thing to occur. In any case, you say the many of the settlers are of Cypriots. Irrespective of whether this is true or not ( most would deny this), you call them CYPRIOTS. As true Cypriots, why do you need the Turkish army in their/our land?? We do not need foreign tropps to solve a domestic problem. What about if Greece come is to protect us, and England comes in to protect the British? How can we call ourselves CYPRIOTS if we have to rely on others to protects us. Its time to start thinking as Cypriots and not as TCs or GCs.!!! I was in Cyprus a few months ago...i crossed the border to teh occupied areas..went to my home after 34 years...i even went through areas that i was not allowed to do before ( Guionelli) when i was growing up there.. What a pity that we had to go through war and division of the land for me to see these places, part of my land. I remember some of my friends being TC, even my parents had very good TC friends. Yes, there were issues..but we managed to live together then....and we shoudl be doing the same in the future...together as Cypriots!
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East Roman Empire
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Sorry friends, you have a long way to go... the same man is called a terrorist by one and Mr. Simpson by one. This happend between countries. A hero of a country may be the devil of the other. But not in one country. It is something like a German calling Mr. Hitler when in a peace treaty with Israel! ozz- wrote: <quoted text> I think Mr Sampson, although a seen as a hero during the 1967 uprising, and then during the fight for independence against the British, was nothing but a puppet for the Greek Junta who orchestrated the coup in Cyprus. He acted like an idiot, amongst the euphoria of the coup. I think his comments about the TCs is nothing but rhetoric. Do you think he would have been allowed to eben touch the TCs??? I am sure he knew that if he did, Turkey would have intervened...as I am sure a lot of GCs and the international community would allow such thing to occur.
In any case, you say the many of the settlers are of Cypriots. Irrespective of whether this is true or not ( most would deny this), you call them CYPRIOTS. As true Cypriots, why do you need the Turkish army in their/our land?? We do not need foreign tropps to solve a domestic problem. What about if Greece come is to protect us, and England comes in to protect the British? How can we call ourselves CYPRIOTS if we have to rely on others to protects us. Its time to start thinking as Cypriots and not as TCs or GCs.!!!
I was in Cyprus a few months ago...i crossed the border to teh occupied areas..went to my home after 34 years...i even went through areas that i was not allowed to do before ( Guionelli) when i was growing up there.. What a pity that we had to go through war and division of the land for me to see these places, part of my land. I remember some of my friends being TC, even my parents had very good TC friends. Yes, there were issues..but we managed to live together then....and we shoudl be doing the same in the future...together as Cypriots!
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ozz-
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East Roman Empire wrote: Sorry friends, you have a long way to go... the same man is called a terrorist by one and Mr. Simpson by one. This happend between countries. A hero of a country may be the devil of the other. But not in one country. It is something like a German calling Mr. Hitler when in a peace treaty with Israel!
<quoted text> Mr SIMPSON!!!! I like that. He had about the same intellectuality and finesse as Bart's father!!! hahah...Anyway, i did say "WAS" seen as a hero during the 60's. I think most lost that respect for him after the coup and self appointment as president...and the topic here is not Sampson...
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BYZANTINE
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ozz- wrote: <quoted text>
Mr SIMPSON!!!! I like that. He had about the same intellectuality and finesse as Bart's father!!! hahah...Anyway, i did say "WAS" seen as a hero during the 60's. I think most lost that respect for him after the coup and self appointment as president...and the topic here is not Sampson... ENDLESS HOT AIR ABOUT MR HOT AIR HIMSELF NIKOS SAMPSON THE IDIOT REACTING TO ALL THE BRITISH AND TURKISH TERRORISMS AND INSTIGATIONS ON CYPRUS THAT DIDNT REALLY WANT CYPRUS TO BE INDEPENDENT..........what a fetish.........LOLOLOL
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Attila
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Someone please explain what is he realy talking about? I do not understand his English perfectly. Do you realy live in memphis or there is another Memphis in another part of the World??? BYZANTINE wrote: <quoted text>ENDLESS HOT AIR ABOUT MR HOT AIR HIMSELF NIKOS SAMPSON THE IDIOT REACTING TO ALL THE BRITISH AND TURKISH TERRORISMS AND INSTIGATIONS ON CYPRUS THAT DIDNT REALLY WANT CYPRUS TO BE INDEPENDENT..........what a fetish.........LOLOLOL
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The Cypriot
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Lee wrote: Read the News Comment where the Vet said 'in a civilised country notices would be put up' re dogs on beach.
I get this and do not mean to be disrespectful to all Cyps, as I do not tar all with the same brush, good and bad in every country, etc, however
the words 'civilised' and 'Cyprus' don't go together when referring to animals. Some Cypriots cruelty to defenceless animals knows no bounds - maddening to know that in the 21st century savagery like this still exists. I can tolerate 'some not all Cyps' dumping their litter all over the island, washing their cars, pavements, patios, gardens and anything else that's static, or moving even, during a water shortage, hard to accept the selfishness of it all, but cowardly cruelty is totally unacceptable. Nothing ever "uncivilized" happens in the UK??? The UK is perfect in every way. Here is a suggestion.... I dare you to post one of the MILLIONS of positive things that happen every day in Cyprus.... Surprise me.... ....by the way ...unlike in Turkey and the occupied areas....we have a court system that will deal with this unfortunate EVENT. Think positive Be positive Try it ... you may like it.
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